ODVV interview: Debate about racism and Australia’s history seems persistent and ongoing

The presence of Muslims in Australia is believed to date back to the 16th and 17th centuries when visitors from Indonesian archipelago made the first contacts with indigenous Australians. Today, there are some 604,000 Muslims in Australia who make up about 2.6% of the country’s population. Although Muslims in Australia are not a sizeable demographic group, they face discrimination and prejudice on different levels and forms. Numerous surveys and studies underline the existence of significant anti-Muslim sentiments in 21st century Australia.

In 2014, the Islamophobia Register of Australia was launched with the aim of documenting anti-Muslim hate crimes in response to the growing evidence suggesting a rise in incidents of Islamophobia. Under the Australian law, discrimination against Muslims is prohibited on both the state and federal level; however, far-right groups opposed to immigration and multiculturalism have shown their impatience with the Muslims through holding rallies and demonstrations, publishing defamatory content in the newspapers and organizing fundraising dinners, and appear to be protected by the government. The stereotypical portrayal of Muslims in the Australian media as uncivilized and violent affects the public perception of Islam and its followers to a great extent. 48 percent of Australians are said to support a permanent ban on Muslims entering the country while 55 percent support a ban on the Islamic face veil.

Organization for Defending Victims of Violence has arranged an interview with Dr. Yassir Morsi, a lecturer in politics at La Trobe University to discuss the rise of Islamophobia and the growth of anti-immigrant sentiments in Australia.

The following is the text of the interview.

Q: In a speech last year, Senator Fraser Anning expressed concern over the fact that Australia currently has the highest net migration rate in the world. He was mostly worried about the Muslim population coming to Australia annually. What is reality? Is Australia facing a crisis of Muslim immigrants? Do these immigrants alter the values and norms of Australian society?

A: Australia’s rate – measured net/immigrants per 1000 citizens – is higher than other western developed countries [like] the US, UK, Canada, etc. But he is twisting the fact. First, this is partly because Australia’s population is significantly smaller than other developed nations, 25 million compared to the 350 million in the US for example. Also, secondly, the top three immigrant-sending countries to Australia are the UK – 1 in 4 immigrants in Australia are from the UK – New Zealand and China. Muslim immigration accounts for about 2% of the total population. There is about 500,000 Muslims in Australia. Even then, Muslims do not constitute a singular identity; it, like most global communities, is a super-diverse community with multiple identities intersecting with Muslims. The only crisis that is happening in Anning’s mind is the crisis of whiteness; a sense that some old nostalgic white Australia is vanishing before the forces of globalization and modernity. Like most racists, Anning blames minorities for things he can’t see or understand or uses them to simplify a message about the fear of change.

Q: The results of a recent survey by the Australian Population Research Institute shows 48% of Australians are in favor of a ban on Muslim immigration to this country. What is behind this attitude? Do you consider President Trump’s Muslim ban and his anti-immigrant rhetoric a determining factor in the Australian people’s abhorrence of Muslim immigrants?

A: Australia shares a lot with America, not only because it is a political ally, but also because it absorbs a lot of America’s cultural debates, absorbs its anxiety and subsequently consumes a lot of American aspirations and fears. I am sure to one degree that Trump’s rhetoric has influenced some Australians. Islamophobia is a global issue, and each country's narrative about the Muslim threat feeds off each other. But it is important also to recognize that Australia has a long history of white fragility. It has its history of racism and fear about the other. Historians and race theorists have documented a constant worry in the white population of their country being “invaded” or taken over, almost since its founding. The “Yellow Peril”, for instance, speaks of fear of Asia “swamping” Australia. It also persists today and manages to merge with concerns about Muslims and Africans. Australia founded as a white settler colony and so far geographically from its mother country Britain, sitting amid Asia, may have had something to do with its constant paranoia and need to over control its racial makeup, such as through the White Australia policy.

Q: Have the 9/11 attacks in the United States had an impact on the growth of Islamophobia in Australia? To what extent is Islamophobia a serious problem?

A: Yes, I think so, but it's essential that we understand that racism and Islamophobia did not come out of 9/11. Many say that 9/11 made it worse for Muslims, but I think that is a non-black Muslim view of things. African-American Muslims have suffered Islamophobia through anti-blackness, and all the policing and securitizing that we see happen against Muslims first happened against African-Americans. As for Australia, I do not think it’s the worst place when it comes to Islamophobia, but that’s partly to do with the size and the passivity of the Muslim community here. That said, when we look at the country’s detention centres and its record with asylum seekers, Australia becomes a leader in the way it inhumanely deals with Muslim bodies.

Q: A report jointly published by the Charles Sturt University and the Western Australia University titled “Islamophobia in Australia” showed that Muslim women, particularly those who wear hijab, are the main victims of Islamophobic hate crimes in the country. Do the police in Australia take such crimes seriously? How is it possible to prevent these incidents from happening?

A: The report is not a very good one and misses a lot in its understanding of how racism plays out and where its sources are. It actively ignores colonialism, whiteness, and does what most post-racial liberals do. It reduces – or over-concerns itself – with racists rather than racism. That said, it is true that the more visible you are as a Muslim, the more likely Islamophobes will target you. Hence, Muslim women wearing hijab are the most vulnerable. A Muslim woman must also navigate the intersections of society’s racism and sexism. For this reason, they have it harder. For, men by themselves and in groups seem always to target women. But it is also true that Islamophobia plays out differently in different places, especially around the issue of policing and security. In this way, the military-aged Muslim black, brown man is the primary target. The state’s fear about the rise of extremism has meant young boys are often the first victim of institutional Islamophobia.

So, to answer your question, in the first instance – policing racists – the police, the state, media, community leaders all mobilize to make sure to condemn individual racist attacks against Muslims. But, the same actors often are less loud or will remain silent or actively get involved in strengthening institutional and Islamophobic practices in targeting Muslim schools, racially profiling Muslims, or creating misleading narratives about Islam’s role in radicalization. On this level, the police are not the community's friend.

Q: One point of view about Islamophobia is that this phenomenon is being subject to normalization and the Muslims who are minority in the Western countries tolerate and condone Islamophobia when they’re on the receiving end of these attacks so that they are accepted as an integral part of the social fabric. What’s your take on that?

A: This theme plays out with the idea that it’s “the Muslims’ turn”. So a common repeated trope is that in Australia each minority group suffers a sort of initiation act, in which the majority distrust a minority and it leads to racism, and over time, this minority slowly overcomes this mistrust and becomes accepted as Australian. Of course, Indigenous Australians have always suffered. Another way your question plays out is in Muslim reactions. Plenty of Muslim voices refuse to react to Islamophobia or minimalize its harm or deem it merely a result of ignorance. There is a belief that Australia is a generally accepting society and that only a few people are ruining it for the majority.

Q: Do you agree with this narrative that Muslims don’t belong in the West, that West cannot absorb and integrate the Muslims and that there is a perennial war between Islam and Western democracy? Is this viewpoint popular in Australia?

A: Islam is rich with ideas and culture and various philosophies as well as temperatures. There are parts of the Muslim world that cannot absorb or integrate one another; the main question of our time may well be how we learn to live with differences. As for the view that Islam is at war with the west. I partly agree there are significant and meaningful grievances between certain Muslim voices and how they see the west. On a historical and political level, there is a history conflict – as well as commonalities – and I think this history needs to be adequately explored and expressed so that understanding of various political positions informs the mainstream. I don’t think the debate should ever be reduced to a conflict or lack of. It’s a dynamic.

Q: How do Islamophobia and fear of Muslims lead to the growth and expansion of terrorist groups such as al-Qaeda and ISIS? What is the responsibility of governments in the developed world, such as the Australian government, to stifle Islamophobia?

A: It all depends on how we define and understand Islamophobia. If we understand it as an ongoing series of policies and interventions into the Muslim world done by European powers, then you can make the argument that Islamophobia creates the conditions that potentially create terrorism; it’s a correlative relationship rather than a casual one though. There are plenty of factors that go into the reason why terrorism occurs. As for the question of responsibility, it’s a good question; I think all thoughts with power must find ways to reflect on what creates oppressive conditions and discrimination. The fight against racism must be a shared fight, but those with power and their institutions must lead the fight.

Q: What’s your view on the role of media in the growth of Islamophobia and other forms of racism or addressing and ameliorating it? How fair and balanced is the image depicted of Muslims and Islam by the Australian media and how does it affect the mentality of the citizens?

A: I, unlike many who work in the field here in Australia, do not place that much emphasis on the role of media. I remain unconvinced as of yet to its actual impact. I think its effect can be overdetermined. I do believe they play a part in shaping the imagery and perpetuating the language of threat, but they are most definitely not the cause of racism or the main actor in creating division as many suggest. Racism, a white view of history, infects multiple institutions in this country, of which media is one. Politicians know how to manipulate media to affect citizens’ sense of comfort about immigrants and Muslims. As for the issue of fairness and balance, I don’t think in mainstream media we have a space that you can say is balanced.

Q: How free are the ultra-nationalist and right-wing parties such as Reclaim Australia, Patriot Blue and United Nationalist Front in promoting their ideology? How do these groups influence the thoughts and approach of the Australian people regarding the Muslims and the Islamic community?

A: I don’t think they are free to do what they wish, but they seem to have more freedom than say the radical Islamic preacher who calls for a similar political revolt against the mainstream. I think that’s partly because many in the mainstream share similar concerns about immigration but do not express it the same brutish way as these groups. Also, they are often caricatured as idiots or buffoons rather than threats. They also serve a function in allowing the face of racism to be defined by such imagery. As for their influence, I will say the far right across Europe and North America have significantly shaped the discourse about how we should see Islam. In many ways, they have made it acceptable to see racism as an act of revolution against the supposed liberal center that protects Islam.

Q: You once said that Australia rejects debate on racism and “thrives on muting discussion on racism.” Do the educational system, media and the public sphere in Australia have the readiness to create opportunities for debate and open discussion about racism and discrimination against Muslims and warn the public about the plague of Islamophobia?

A: There is a paradox it seems. The debate about race and racism and Australia’s history seems ever persistent and ongoing. It plays out in media, sometimes parliament, and in educational spaces. However, it’s based on a very tailored definition of racism that reduces it to individual biases, or intentions, rather than viewing the history of how racism created, shaped and informed the Australian state and its main institutions. For this reason, debates about Islamophobia are often stifled and rarely move on beyond discussions about Islamophobic incidents or whether Islam is or is not a race. To answer your question bluntly I don’t think the Australian mainstream does provide enough space for public growth on this topic.

By Kourosh Ziabari